AMNA NAWAZ: Good evening.

I'm Amna Nawaz.

GEOFF BENNETT: And I'm Geoff Bennett.

On the "News Hour" tonight: Diplomats# lay the .. talks between the U.S.

and Iran, as Americans'# appetite for a prolonged conflict grows thin.

AMNA NAWAZ: A jury finds Ticketmaster## and Live Nation monopolized the# market and gouged ticket prices.

GEOFF BENNETT: And Judy Woodruff# looks into how and why the long## tradition of volunteering took root in the U.S.

ZAY HARTIGAN, Chief, Patagonia Volunteer Fire# and Rescue: A lot of volunteers, just they look## and they say, someone ought to do that.

And then# they say, well, I'm someone.

I'm going to do it.

(BREAK) GEOFF BENNETT: Welcome to the "News Hour."

International mediators tonight are pushing# for new peace talks between the U.S... and they're seeking to extend the# cease-fire that's set to expire next week.

AMNA NAWAZ: But nothing is set in stone,# and the sides remain far apart on issues## like the fate of Iran's nuclear# program and the Strait of Hormuz.

White House correspondent Liz Landers has# been tracking it all and starts our coverage.

LIZ LANDERS: The waters remain quiet through the# Strait of Hormuz.

The U.S.

military says its naval## blockade of Iran's ports is -- quote -- "fully# implemented" as it approaches its third full day.

But with the cease-fire between the U.S.# and Iran expiring in less than a week,## beneath the surface and behind the# scenes, there's been a flurry of## diplomatic conversations.

Regional leaders# like Turkey's President Recep Tayyip Erdogan## said efforts were under way to restart talks# between the U.S.

and Iran and to buy more time.

RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN, Turkish President# (through translator): We are making## the necessary suggestions and# attempts to .. extend the cease-fire and# continue the negotiations.

LIZ LANDERS: More regional officials say they're## making progress on both fronts# after last weekend's failed talks,## including that the U.S.

and Iran have agreed# in principle on extending the cease-fire.

Publicly, however, U.S.

and Iranian# officials say they have not formally## agreed to anything and that engagement continues.

White House Press Secretary# Karoline Leavitt today: KAROLINE LEAVITT, White House Press Secretary:# That these conversations are productive and## ongoing, and that's where we are right now.# I have also seen some reporting about the## potentiality for in-person discussions# again.

Those discussions are being had,## but nothing is official until you hear# it from us here at the White House.

LIZ LANDERS: In Iran today, Pakistani military# leaders arrived as mediators to discuss plans for## a new round of talks.

And Pakistani Prime Minister# Shehbaz Sharif, who hosted the last round of talks## and is considered a top intermediary, visits# Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Turkey through Saturday.

President Trump has suggested that talks# could be imminent, and in an interview this## morning on FOX Business, he said once again# that so could be the end of the war itself.

MARIA BARTIROMO, FOX News Anchor: Well,# you keep saying was.

Is this war over?

DONALD TRUMP, President of the United# States: I think it's close to over,## yes.

I mean, I view it as very close to over.

LIZ LANDERS: But on the biggest# sticking point in the talks,## any nuclear threat coming from Iran, the president## implied a more open-ended mission and again# threatened Iran's civilian infrastructure.

DONALD TRUMP: If they're going to have a# new nuclear weapon, we will be living with## them for a little while, but I don't know how# much longer they can survive.

As an example,## we could take out every one of their bridges# in one hour.

We could take out every one of## their power plants, electric power plants,# in one hour.

We don't want to do that.

LIZ LANDERS: But many experts say Iran# was nowhere near a nuclear weapon.

While visiting Asia today, Rafael Grossi, the# head of the United Nations nuclear watchdog,## said Iran's nuclear activities are# a reality that must be monitored.

RAFAEL GROSSI, Director General, International# Atomic Energy Agency: Iran has a very ambitious,## wide nuclear program.

So all of that will# require the presence of IAEA inspectors.## Otherwise, you will not have an agreement.# You will have an illusion of an agreement.

LIZ LANDERS: At an event with# young conservatives last night,## Vice President J.D.

Vance said that the U.S.# wouldn't settle for a small deal with Iran.

J.D.

VANCE, Vice President of the United# States: Right now, the cease-fire is## holding.

And what you're seeing is# what the president wants to ma.. he doesn't want to make like a small# deal.

He wants to make the grand bargain.

LIZ LANDERS: But Vance was also# heckled in the same event by## members of the audience who clearly# oppose the wars in the Middle East.

J.D.

VANCE: I certainly think the# answer is yes.

And I agree.

Jesus## Christ does not -- I agree.

Jesus Christ# certainly does not support genocide,## whoever yelled that out from# the dark.

He certainly does not.

LIZ LANDERS: Vance would# acknowledge their concerns.

J.D.

VANCE: I recognize that# a lot of young voters don't## love the policy that we have in the# Middle East, OK?

I understand that.

LIZ LANDERS: Today, in a test of Congress'# appetite for prolonging the Iran conflict: MAN: The motion is not agreed to.

LIZ LANDERS: Senate Republicans stood# behind President Trump and struck down## another Democratic-driven war powers effort to# block his ability to launch further strikes.

The treasury secretary today suggested## the U.S.

could strike Iran in a# different way, economically.

The SCOTT BESSENT, U.S.

Treasury Secretary:# Iranians should know that this is going to## be the financial equivalent of what# we saw in the kinetic activities.

LIZ LANDERS: Regardless of political leanings,# almost all Americans are feeling the pain at## the gas pump as the result of the# war.

Average prices remain above## $4 a gallon.

The treasury secretary# telling Americans this Tax Day: SCOTT BESSENT: The message is the# short-term volatility for long-term gain.

LIZ LANDERS: That optimism will be roundly# challenged in the waters of the Gulf,## as the White House navigates# a tense and narrow strait.

For the "PBS News Hour," I'm Liz Landers.

AMNA NAWAZ: Now to Lebanon, where# the toll of the wider war has## been severe.

More than one million# Lebanese are displaced.

Israel has## invaded the country's south again and# is demanding people vacate more land.

The United Nations' top refugee official# is there on a mission to survey the crisis,## and he sat down earlier today with# special correspondent Simona Foltyn.

SIMONA FOLTYN: Dr.

Barham Salih, thank you# very much for speaking to the "News Hour."

BARHAM SALIH, United Nations High# Commissioner for Refugees: Thank you.

SIMONA FOLTYN: Isr.. That's around a fifth of the population.# What has been the humanitarian impact?

BARHAM SALIH: It's undoubtedly very profound.

This# is truly a rapidly deepening humanitarian crisis.

Imagine the impact that this is# causing to the entire society,## to the entire country.

I have visited a# number of places, including shelters.

And## these are heart-wrenching scenes,# the stories that you're told,## people leaving everything behind, literally# in a matter of minutes walking miles on foot## to get to safety areas and so on.

This is truly# a humanitarian catastrophe by all standards.

And, remember, Lebanon has been a host of# refugees for so long.

Hundreds of thousands## of Syrian refugees have taken residence in this# country for more than a decade.

Not to mention## refugees from other places in the Middle# East.

For Lebanon to be impacted this way,## time and again, to be fair, is# really very sad, very painful.

SIMONA FOLTYN: Doing our reporting, we have seen# people sleep in their cars, sleep under tents.

SIMONA FOLTYN: The schools that have# been turned into displacement shelters## are at capacity.

What are some of the bottlenecks## that the Lebanese government and the# international community are facing?

BARHAM SALIH: To be fair, the government# is doing a lot.

The government is extremely## challenging.

It is operating in a very difficult# political, as well as economic condition.

But, to be fair, this government is trying# hard.

I think it's incumbent upon us in the## international community to help the government# of Lebanon, to help the state of Lebanon.

But## no amount of humanitarian assistance can really# deal with the scale, the scope of this crisis.

Look, nothing can replace losing your home.

And# many of these people have already seen their homes## destroyed.

And even the prospects of the returns# to their communities are somewhat in doubt.

SIMONA FOLTYN: The Lebanese government has# just issued fresh statistics saying that## more than 37,000 housing units have been# destroyed, many of them in Lebanon itself.

This means that, even when the fighting stops,# many families won't have a place to return to.

BARHAM SALIH: This is a very serious problem.

Many# of these homes have been destroyed in the south,## so these displaced people, at the end of the day,## they need to go back to their homes.# And the homes are already destroyed.

This is going to cause Lebanon, cause# the people of Lebanon not to mention## the victims themselves, a huge, huge problem.

SIMONA FOLTYN: More than 2,000 people have# now been killed by Israeli bombardment,## more than 300 on April 8 alone in what# is now known as Black Wednesday.

Roughly## a third of that were women, children, and the# elderly.

Israel says it's targeting Hezbollah.

You have visited some of these strike# locations.

Was there anything to suggest## that these buildings that were# being hit were military objects?

BARHAM SALIH: No doubt many of the casualties# are civilians, undeniably, so that the evidence## speaks for itself in the sense of the# word, whether Hezbollah is there or not.

At the end of the day, attacking civilians,## whether in Lebanon in the way that we have# seen, in Northern Israel that we have seen,## these are all acts that are unacceptable and# should not be happening.

Targeting civilians## and targeting civilian infrastructure is# something that is totally unacceptable.

This violence, this conflict, this war# really needs to be brought to an end,## and there is no military solution to# this.

There has to be a political,## diplomatic settlement based on security, based on## respect for sovereignty and respect for the# rights of the people in this part of the world.

SIMONA FOLTYN: Israel has maintained that it wants## to keep a depopulated buffer zone in# Lebanon's south.

Does that co.. BARHAM SALIH: Of course it concerns# me, unless these diplomatic## initiatives and efforts are going# to lead to a lasting security and## peaceful settlement that will end# these type of arrangements, because,## at the end of the day, any of these areas are# homes to people who have lived there forever.

And for them to leave their homes is not# something that anyone can condone or accept.

SIMONA FOLTYN: Do you see that there is sufficient# appetite on the part of international donors to## support the Lebanese government?

And# what is the funding gap at the moment?

BARHAM SALIH: I think, to be fair, the United# Nations has already published an appeal,## a flash appeal, calling for $308 million for# various U.N.

agencies.

UNHCR has called for## about $61 million specifically targeted at# Lebanon to deal with the displacement crisis.

We have been receiving some contributions.# We're grateful for those, but they are## nowhere near enough to deal with the scope# and the scale of the problem that we have.## We need more.

We need more engagement.

And# remember also, so we're not only dealing## with the displacement that is happening# as a result of the last few weeks of war.

We are also dealing with large, large# numbers of Syrian refugees who remain here,## who have already been -- because of these events,# have been displaced a year again.

And so you can## imagine the kind of humanitarian consequences# that this is bringing to bear.

And our teams## are working hard at this to try to deliver the# assistance needed for the people who need it.

SIMONA FOLTYN: Dr.

Barham Salih, thank# you for speaking to the "News Hour."

BARHAM SALIH: Thank you.

AMNA NAWAZ: And late this evening in Israel,# Prime Minister.. had ordered an expansion of the Israeli# invasion of Southern Lebanon to occupy## more territory and to march eastward to expand# what they call a security zone along Israel's## northern border.

GEOFF BENNETT:## In the day's other headlines: Time is running# out for Americans to file their taxes.

And new## data shows refunds are larger this year, though,# not nearly as big as the Trump administration had## projected.

The IRS says the average refund# so far this tax season is just under $3,500.

That's up around $350 from last# year, but it's far short of the## thousands of dollars or more that the# White House projected back in January.

REP.

MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): We# don't believe you should send## it all here to Uncle Sam.

We want you to keep it.

GEOFF BENNETT: On Capitol Hill today,# House Republicans touted new tax breaks,## which include no taxes on tips and overtime, as# well as deductions for some seniors.

Democrats,## meantime, countered that any gains# are being wiped out by higher prices.

REP.

PETE AGUILAR (D-CA): The American# people are seeing their costs increase.## Even if they get a tiny bit of relief filing# their taxes, every month, they're paying more.

GEOFF BENNETT: Also on Capitol Hill today, the# head of the IRS told a Senate committee that his## agency is working to address the tax gap.

That's# taxes owed, but not paid.

That's even as the IRS## has seen its work force shrink around 27 percent# since President Trump returned to the White House.

Officials on a group of U.S.

islands in# the Pacific Ocean are assessing damage## from Tropical Storm Sinlaku, which battered# the region with fierce winds and rains.## Eyewitness footage shows the aftermath of what# was the year's most powerful tropical typhoon,## which flipped cars and left many without power.

Meantime, in other parts of the country,# powerful storms ripped through parts of## Michigan, toppling trees and damaging# buildings.

Some areas also saw flooding,## while, in Iowa, storm chasers filmed this# tornado, which touched down yesterday.

It's## part of a severe weather pattern that's# been hammering the Plains and Midwest.

And it comes as a heat wave sweeps across the East# Coast today, with record temperatures expected in## cities like New York and Philadelphia.

Forecasters# expect the heat to last well into the weekend.

In Turkey, officials there say a student opened# fire on two classrooms in a middle school today,## killing at least nine people.

It's the country's# second school shooting in as many days.

Chaos## unfolded outside that school as parents and# emergency personnel rushed to the scene.

Turkey's interior minister says the suspected# gunman is a 14-year-old student who was killed,## though he did not specify how.# The motive remains unclear.

MUSTAFA CIFTCI, Turkish Interior Minister# (through translator): This incident was an## individual act committed by only one# of our s.. terrorism.

I want to express once# again how deeply saddened we are.

GEOFF BENNETT: Officials in Turkey have# imposed a nationwide ban on publishing## images from the shooting that are considered# traumatic.

School shootings are rare in Turkey,## making this week's attacks all the more striking.

Sudan entered its fourth year of war# today, with millions facing the threat## of ongoing violence and famine.

In Eastern# Sudan, health workers are reporting a spike## in malnourished children since the fighting# started.

A U.N.-backed group has warned that## some 800,000 people will suffer from severe# acute malnutrition across Sudan this year.

Meantime, at an aid conference in# Berlin, European countries pledged## more than $1.5 billion in humanitarian# aid.

A U.S.

official at the meeting says## the Trump administration -- quote -- "remains# steadfast in its commitment to ending this war."

MASSAD BOULOS, U.S.

Senior Adviser for# Arab and African Affairs: We are working## closely with partners in.. from battlefield to the negotiating# table, from violence to dialogue,## and for ending this world's# biggest humanitarian crisis.

GEOFF BENNETT: The war between Sudan's military# and the Rapid Support Forces paramilitary group,## or RSF, erupted in April of 2023.# Since then, officials say around## 59,000 people have been killed and at# least 13 million have been displaced.

On Wall Street today, stocks ended mixed as hopes# rise for a possible end to the war with Iran.

The## Dow Jones industrial average slipped about 70# points on the day.

The Nasdaq jumped nearly 400## points to a new all-time high, and the S&P# 500 continued its rally from recent lows.

And Major League Baseball is celebrating# Jackie Robinson Day.

The annual event marks## the day back in 1947 when Robinson# broke the sports color barrier.

MAN: Every child who dares# to dream and every voice## that lives and inspires others, Jackie lives on.

GEOFF BENNETT: This year, the MLB rolled out## a splashy campaign in his honor.

And# across the league, players, coaches,## and umpires are wearing his iconic number# 42 on their jerseys during today's games.

Still to come on the "News Hour": the# Department of Justice moves to negate## more convictions for Capitol insurrectionists;# Donald Trump and J.D.

Vance continue their## attacks on the pope over the war against# Iran; and author Susan Page discusses her## book on the late Queen Elizabeth's# relationships with U.S.

presidents.

AMNA NAWAZ: A federal jury has found Live# Nation and its subsidiary Ticketmaster## have been operating as a monopoly in# violation of federal and state laws.## It's the long-awaited conclusion to a# blockbuster antitrust trial that could## have big implications for both the company# and the entertainment industry at large.

Dozens of states were party to the# suit, which argued that Live Nation## used its combined control of ticketing# platforms and a nationwide network of## concert venues to force artists into bad# deals and drive up prices for consumers.

For more on this, we're joined by Jem# Aswad.

He's music editor at "Variety."

Jem, thanks so much for being with us.

Before we get into details, just for context here,## how big a moment is this for Live# Nation, Ticketmaster, and the industry?

JEM ASWAD, Executive Music Editor, "Variety": It# is a big moment, but nobody knows yet what exactly## it is going to mean.

It is very much a rebuke to# the Department of Justice's decision early last## month to settle with Live Nation and have them# modify some of their policies and pay a few fines.

I think it was $260 million, which# Live Nation earns in a couple of days.

AMNA NAWAZ: We should point out that suit# was first filed by the Biden administration.## That's when the DOJ was involved.

When# the Trump administration came into office,## the DOJ a few days in walked away.

The# state decided to continue with that lawsuit,## which is how we ended up where we are today.

But, in retrospect, that settlement that# they reached, how does that look right now?

JEM ASWAD: Well, it was never approved by# the judge.

This is all being decided by one## judge.

Arun Subramanian I think# is how you say his name.

And he## was furious over the settlement because it# was basically done in a smoke-filled room.

There was a deal between DOJ officials and## Live Nation CEO Michael Rapino and presumably# some other people.

And the judge didn't even## know.

So he was furious over that.

And the# states decided to continue pushing ahead.

Now, does this mean that Live Nation and# Ticketmaster are going to be broken up and## tickets are going to get a# lot cheaper?

Absolutely not.

AMNA NAWAZ: We will get into more on that and# what we could expect ahead in just a moment.

But I want to remind folks about what the argument# was here behind the monopoly prosecution.

So,## DOJ was basically arguing that# they were stifling innovation,## they were causing higher prices for# consumers.

Remind people how they were## doing that.

What were the actual practices# they were alleged to have engaged in?

JEM ASWAD: I mean, there are so# many, it's a little hard to begin.

The practices that they were really being# criticized for really only trickled down to## consumers, quite honestly.

But it was things# like -- I don't -- I got to be careful with## the verbs here.

Like, persuading venues to# use Ticketmaster, their ticketing service.

And Rapino is heard in a recorded phone call# kind of threatening a venue by saying, well,## if you don't go with Ticketmaster and you# go with our competitor, boy, I don't know,## we're going to have a hard time routing some# of our big artists to your venue.

And that## venue is Barclays Center in Brooklyn, one# of the biggest arenas in the tristate area.

AMNA NAWAZ: Rapino, we should note, is the head## of Live Nation.

And those stories I# know were reported on fo.. As you mentioned, though, we do not yet know# what the remedies could be.

We should point out## in the verdict that the jury found Ticketmaster# overcharged consumers by about $1.72 a ticket.## Is there a chance here that concertgoers# could see some of their money coming back?

JEM ASWAD: It is really hard to say.

It's# very early in this process, quite honestly.

And we need to be fair to Live Nation here.

They# did not create this system.

The problem stems from## when ticketing went online, because, before, when# it was just hard tickets, you couldn't have a bot## buying up thousands of tickets and flipping them# for exponentially more than their face value.

And Live Nation has tried to fight that syndrome.# Sometimes, they're successful.

Sometimes,## they're not.

They're up against the most# sophisticated bots in the world.

So,## in sympathy to them, they are trying# to keep things in the stakeholders,## the people who actually put money and have# skin in the game with putting on shows,## venues, artists, managers, promoters, people# like that, instead of bots and scalpers.

But they do play rough.

And, I mean,# this is a capitalist society.

We're## allowed to push the limits to a# degree.

But the question here is## whether they pushed them too far.

And# the jury today found that they did.

AMNA NAWAZ: Live Nation has inarguably# been an absolute force in this industry,## right?

According to some of the trial testimony,## they sold about 10 times the number of# tickets as the next closest competitor.

What else have we heard from# them over the course of this## trial?

What's been their response to# the accusations about their practices?

JEM ASWAD: Oh, throughout, they have been saying,## we're not a monopoly.

We play rough.# They don't say, we pla.. we're competitive and we're aggressive, all of# which is certainly true and somewhat defensible.

But when you start getting into some of the# details, like with them trying to explain away## those famous Slack messages# where people are saying, oh,## my gosh, can you believe these# suckers, meaning concertgoers## paying for tickets.

It wasn't that exactly words# -- exactly those words, but it was the sentiment.

The particulars, they were less strong# on.

But, generally, they're just saying,## we are not a monopoly.

They# dispute a lot of the numbers,## the percentages of how much of the# ticketing market they have.

The## prosecution said it was about 86 percent.

They# said, oh, no, no, no, it's more like 44 percent.

And with anything like that, it's how# you slice and dice the numbers.

But## they have basically been saying,# we are playing by the rules.

And## it is up to the jury to decide# whether or not they believe that.

AMNA NAWAZ: We will see what happens next.

That is Jem Aswad, music editor for "Variety."

Jem, thank you so much.

JEM ASWAD: Thank you.

GEOFF BENNETT:## The Justice Department is at the center# of multiple major developments this week,## from a new report alleging political# weaponization under former President Biden,## to fresh efforts to reverse January# 6 convictions, to an unusual visit## connected to an inquiry involving the# Federal Reserve chair, Jerome Powell.

Our justice correspondent, Ali# Rogin, joins us now with the latest.

So, Ali, let's start with this legal# effort to drop the convictions connected## to the most serious crimes related# to January 6.

What more do you know?

ALI ROGIN: Yes, so to understand this latest news,## it's helpful to go back to the beginning of# President Trump's term, right after inauguration.. when he issued a blanket pardon for most of# the January 6 rioters, more than 1,000 people.

Trump did not pardon everyone, though.# There were 14 members of the extremist## groups the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers whose# sentences he commuted, meaning he reduced them,## but he didn't outright pardon them.

Those people# included Oath Keepers head Stewart Rhodes,## who was facing 18 years in prison and was among# -- had the most serious convictions against him.

So, those 14, once those commutations came# in, they were released from their sentences,## but their cases were still making their# way through the appeals process.

Now what## has happened is, the Department of# Justice is asking the D.C.

Appeals## Court to completely dismiss# these cases with prejudice.

That means that the cases# will permanently be closed,## and the DOJ said in a short filing that this# is in the interests of justice.

This is,## however, a major blow to those attorneys who# previously were at the DOJ and prosecuted these## January 6 cases, many of which# had already been wiped away.

But some of them today said that this was# a reminder that the administration does## not care about constitutional due process, Geoff.

GEOFF BENNETT: And, separately, the Justice# Department released a report alleging that## the Biden Justice Department weaponized# the agency against its perceived enemies,## which is the very thing the Trump Justice# Department is accused of.

How did this come to be?

ALI ROGIN: Yes, this is the first product of# the so-called Weaponization Working Group,## which is something that former# Attorney General Pam Bondi stood up.

The stated goal was to uncover instances# of the Biden administration using the## levers of government power to achieve# political ends.

This report is about## the Biden DOJ's application of a# law that criminalizes interfering## with someone who is seeking to access# reproductive care, including abortion.

It's known as the FACE Act.

And the report alleges# that the Biden administration selectively enforced## the act by protecting abortion clinics, but not# other pregnancy centers that oppose abortion## rights, that they coordinated with pro-abortion# rights advocacy groups, exercised prosecutorial## misconduct, including screening jurors based on# religion, and that they sought longer sentences## for defendants who oppose abortion rights# than for those who support those rights.

Meanwhile, a former leader of the Biden era's DOJ## Civil Rights Division says that that# team enforced the law evenhandedly.

GEOFF BENNETT: And what more have you# learned about the way the Trump Justice## Department purged the people, the# prosecutors who worked on past cases?

ALI ROGIN: That's right.

I heard today from a d.. the department has fired personnel# who worked on those Biden era FACE## Act cases who had previously remained# employed at the Department of Justice.

Geoff, of course, all of this is happening as# President Trump has repeatedly and directly## called for the Department of Justice to prosecute# his political adversaries.

And Acting Attorney## General Todd Blanche, in an interview with# NBC last night, defended that contact.

TODD BLANCHE, Acting U.S.

Attorney General: That# type of communication from President Trump should## make every American happy, because it means# that there's an executive, a chief executive,## that is making sure every one of his Cabinet# members are working as hard as they should.

So, the president is a driver of# results, and so I don't have any## issues with that.

And as a matter of# fact, I think it's why he was elected.

GEOFF BENNETT: So add to all of that the# DOJ continues to investigate the Fed chair,## Jerome Powell.

And this includes a# visit to the construction site where## the Fed headquarters is undergoing# a renovation.

What more do you know?

ALI ROGIN: This was an attempt to# progress in that investigation,## which has seen multiple roadblocks, yesterday.

These employees from the D.C.

U.S.

attorney's# office made an unannounced visit to the site## of the Fed renovation.

They were trying to# check on progress at the site, this after,## last month, a federal judge threw out subpoenas# the Department of Justice issued to the Fed,## saying that there was abundant evidence that# the main purpose of these subpoenas and this## investigation was to harass and pressure# Fed Chair Jerome Powell to either resign or## yield to President Trump's policy demands.

Upon hearing of this unannounced visit# yesterday, outside counsel for the Fed## e-mailed the employees who tried to seek# access and told them that the federal judge## had concluded that their interest in this site# was -- quote -- "pretextual" and asked that## they commit not to seek to communicate with the# Fed outside of the presence of counsel, Geoff.

GEOFF BENNETT: All right, lots to track.

Ali Rogin, our thanks to you, as always.

ALI ROGIN: You bet.

AMNA NAWAZ:## The battle between the president and# the pope continues to play out on the## world stage.

And some allies of President# Trump are piling on to defend the war in## Iran.

The pope has not backed down from# his criticisms of the conflict either,## but he's taking a different# approach during his visit to Africa.

POPE LEO XIV, Leader of Catholic# Church: Good morning everyone.

AMNA NAWAZ: On his flight from# Algeria to Cameroon today,## Pope Leo avoided President Trump's war of words# and told journalists that the world needs peace.

POPE LEO XIV: Although we have different# beliefs, we have different ways of worshiping,## we have different ways of living,# we can live together in peace.

AMNA NAWAZ: His message came after a new social# media post from the president this morning sharing## an image of himself being cradled by Jesus.# President Trump deleted a controversial post from## earlier in the week of himself depicted as Jesus# that prompted criticism from many Christians.

But Christian and even Catholic members of# the Trump administration are standing behind## the president.

At a Turning Point USA event# in Georgia last night, Catholic convert and## Vice President J.D.

Vance disagreed with Leo's# theology and suggested the pope should be careful.

J.D.

VANCE, Vice President of the# United States: When the pope says## that God is never on the side of# those who wield the sword, there## is 1,000-year -- more-than-1,000-year tradition# of just war theory, OK?

Now, we can, of course,## have disagreements about whether this or that# conflict is just, but I think that it's important.

In the same way that it's important for# the vice president of the United States## to be careful when I talk about matters# of public policy.

I think it's very,## very important for the pope to be careful# when he talks about matters of theology.

AMNA NAWAZ: Many Republicans have stayed# quiet or urged the president to leave## the church alone.

But, today, House Speaker# Mike Johnson backed Vance and the president.

REP.

MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): Obviously,# if you wade into political waters,## I think you should expect some political response,# and I think the pope's received some of that.

AMNA NAWAZ: The battle between the Vatican# and the White House began last weekend,## when Pope Leo spoke out in his strongest# terms yet against the war in Iran.## Leo denounced the -- quote --# "delusion of omnipotence" that## he argued was fueling the war in# Iran and other global conflicts.

Trump unloaded with a TRUTH Social post,## calling Pope Leo -- quote -- "weak on crime# and terrible for foreign policy" and said,## if it wasn't for his reelection, "Leo# wouldn't be the first American pope."

On Monday, he doubled down.

DONALD TRUMP, President of the United States: We# believe strongly in law and order.

And h.. to have a problem with that.

So there's# nothing to apologize for.

He's wrong.

AMNA NAWAZ: And that same# day, Pope Leo was defiant.

POPE LEO XIV: I do not look at my role# as being political, a politician.

I don't## want to get into a debate with him.

I don't# think that the message of the Gospel is meant## to be abused in the way that some people are# doing.

And I will continue to speak about this.

AMNA NAWAZ: We're joined now# by Reverend James Martin.

He's## a Jesuit priest and editor at# large of "America" magazine.

Father Martin, welcome back to the# "News Hour."

Thanks for being with us.

REV.

JAMES MARTIN, Editor at# Large, "America": My pleasure.

AMNA NAWAZ: So let me ju.. warn Pope Leo to be careful on matters# of theology.

What was your reaction?

REV.

JAMES MARTIN: That you have the vice# president warning the vicar of Christ,## who is an Augustinian, who is at that time# visiting the birthplace of St.

Augustine,## and who knows more about St.

Augustine than most# people have forgotten, that he doesn't understand## just war and that he doesn't understand theology,# I just found that really hard to swallow.

AMNA NAWAZ: Father Martin, this idea of just# war, what should we understand about that?

REV.

JAMES MARTIN: Well, it's an ancient# concept in the Catholic Church and in the## Christian church more broadly that talks about# the types of requirements that are needed for## war to be considered just.

And people can# go online and find them all.

For example,## there has to be a proportionate# response that's usually in defense.

And pretty much every theologian,# including Cardinal Robert McElroy,## who's a doctorate in theology and political# science, Archbishop Timothy Broglio,## former head of the USCCB, have concluded this# is not a just war in Iran.

So it's a certain## number of qualifications that they# needed to consider a war to be just.

AMNA NAWAZ: You posted a# very lengthy response online,## called out what you saw as the ironies of# Vice President Vance's criticism of the pope.

You also noted his conversion, and then you wrote:# "We rejoice over everyone entering the church.## What most of us do not rejoice over, however, is# a deadly combination of inaccuracy and hubris."

What did you mean by that?

REV.

JAMES MARTIN: Well, the inaccuracy# is that he doesn't seem to understand## the tenets of just war, which you can look up# all the Catholic leaders and cardinals and the## U.S.

Conference of Catholic Bishops that have# talked about that in the past couple of days.

And the hubris is telling the pope, of all# people, who has a doctorate in canon law## from a pontifical university and who has been# an Augustinian for many years, that he doesn't## understand theology.

It's really pretty hard to# imagine calling it anything other than hubris.

AMNA NAWAZ: And, as we just reported,# Father Martin, I have to ask you about## these pictures.

The president posted that# A.I.

image of himself being cradled by## Jesus.

That followed an A.I.

image of himself# as Jesus that he later deleted.

That followed,## we should remind people, an# A.I.

image of himself as pope.

Do these images go too far, in your view?

REV.

JAMES MARTIN: Yes, I mean, particularly the# one where he is picturing himself as Jesus.

Some## people have used the term blasphemy.

I think# it's more appropriate to call it idolatrous.

The First Commandment is, you shall have# no other Gods before me.

And so to picture## yourself as Jesus is really trespassing into# that territory.

And it's not just Catholics## who are upset.

I think any Christian who saw that# would have to scratch their heads or be offended.

AMNA NAWAZ: You know, we have saw there Pope# Leo say that he does not fear the president,## right, indicating he will continue to speak out# if he disagrees with something that he sees.

Is it fair to say that this is a pope who# is more willing to publicly disagree with## or to take on the president of# the United States than before?

REV.

JAMES MARTIN: I think that's not a# particularly good way of looking at it,## because it sets it up as a battle.

He's basically preaching the Gospel.# And, look, in the Gospels, Jesus says.. blessed are the peacemakers, not blessed are# the warmongers.

And after the resurrection,## he appears to the frightened disciples and# says, peace be with you, not vengeance is mine.

So the pope is proclaiming the Gospel and# these Christian messages of peace.

And if## it has a political implication, I think he# feels, so be it.

But he's not looking to## fight with President Trump or# any other political leader.

AMNA NAWAZ: Do you worry at# all that this pulls him into## what are seen as partisan or political battles?

REV.

JAMES MARTIN: No, I'm not worried at# all, because he's sticking to the Gospels.

I think what worries me the most is that,# when President Trump attacks the pope,## attacks the Holy Father, he gives rein to -- or# free rein to a lot of anti-Catholicism and also## just sort of denigrates the office and# denigrates a really important moral voice,## which I think people should listen to.

AMNA NAWAZ: What are you hearing from members of# the Catholic community at this time about all of## these headlines, about the pope's leadership# and these public feuds that we're seeing?

REV.

JAMES MARTIN: Well, I would say# Catholics from traditional Catholics to## progressive Catholics were really pretty appalled.

And people have been saying it's ironic# because this is the one thing that has## sort of pulled the Catholic community together# in the United States.

But there's a great deal## of love and affection for Pope Leo.

I think he# has something like an 84 percent approval rating.

But people like the guy.

And so# to see someone disparage the pope,## which is really disparaging the# representative of the Catholic Church,## and therefore disparaging the Catholic# Church, is very hard for people to take.

So,## all -- pretty much all the Catholics# I have talked to have been appalled.

AMNA NAWAZ: Do you think there's anything to this# being the first American pope that makes him more## of a focus of the American president's# ire when he feels he disagrees with him?

REV.

JAMES MARTIN: I think that's accurate,# because I think you can no longer use the excuse,## as some people did under Pope Francis# and even Pope Benedict and Pope John## Paul, that the pope doesn't# understand the United States.

So I think that gives his critiques or what# are perceived as critiques a lot more weight.

AMNA NAWAZ: That is the Reverend James Martin,## editor at large of "America"# magazine, joining us tonight.

Father Martin, thank you.

It's# always good to speak with you.

REV.

JAMES MARTIN: My pleasure.

GEOFF BENNETT:## Before the United States was founded, the# spirit of volunteering was already taking## hold in the colonies.

Today, Americans give more# of their time than citizens of any other country.

During this National Volunteer Month, our# Judy Woodruff set out to explore how this## tradition started and why it remains# such a defining part of the nation's## identity.

It's part of her# series America at a Crossroads.

JUDY WOODRUFF: The Patagonia all-volunteer# fire department has been a fixture of this## small Arizona border town for 102 years.

Its# firefighters cover 333 miles of surrounding land,## fighting every fire that comes their way,# while also providing vital emergency medical## services to the largely rural# mining and ranching community.

ZAY HARTIGAN, Chief, Patagonia Volunteer Fire# and Rescue: I think you find a lot of volunteers,## just they look and they say, someone# ought to do that.

And then they say,## well, I'm someone.

I'm going to do it.

JUDY WOODRUFF: Zay Hartigan# is the fire chief here... ZAY HARTIGAN: Just the jacket# here is a pretty heavy item.

JUDY WOODRUFF: ... overseeing 35 other volunteers## who are following what it turns# out is a long American tradition.

In 1736, founding father Benjamin Franklin# established the first formally organized## volunteer fire brigade in the colonies.# The Union Fire Company in Philadelphia## had 26 members and would become a model for how# fires in the new nation would be fought.

Today,## at least 65 percent of firefighters in# the United States are still volunteers.

ELISABETH CLEMENS, University of# Chicago: Rates of volunteering are... JUDY WOODRUFF: Elisabeth Clemens of the# University of Chicago studies the roots## of volunteerism and the way volunteer# groups organize.

We spoke at another## hub for volunteers in the warehouse# of the Community Food Bank in Tucson.

ELISABETH CLEMENS: When we think about# volunteerism, we think about well-meaning## individuals who give freely of their time# and money.

And that's absolutely important.## But what it misses is the extent# to which the sort of governance of## American society was done by these groups.# These groups become powerful and critical.

JUDY WOODRUFF: What was it about the founding of# the country that left it important for American## citizens to come up with some of these structures# that would get the country up and running?

ELISABETH CLEMENS: Well, there wasn't much there,# right?

There wasn't much government.

And to have## a revolution to establish a government is# done by committees, some of which look very## voluntary.

So this idea that you can do public# action, whether it's responding to a natural## disaster or supporting an ally in war, that# you don't have to wait for government to do it.

NATALIE JAYROE, CEO, Community Food Bank: We# could not do what we do without our volunteers.

JUDY WOODRUFF: Natalie Jayroe is the# CEO of the Tucson community food bank,## which, on the day we visited, served 1,# 621 people with emergency food boxes.

WOMAN: Thank you.

JUDY WOODRUFF: What would it mean if these## individuals weren't giving# their tonnage to this place?

NATALIE JAYROE: A lot more people would be# hungry; 80 percent of everything that comes into## a food bank comes from private sources, and that's# private donations, that's food from manufacturers,## retailers, but that's also all the labor that# our volunteers give us on an everyday basis.

JUDY WOODRUFF: It's an idea# that Clemens says differs from## the European countries our founders left behind.

ELISABETH CLEMENS: In American political# development, there is a suspicion, I think,## of government doing too much, and so we have been# more reliant on ways of providing public goods## that don't look like government, even if there's# a fair amount of government hidden in them.

PEDRO TADEO, Volunteer, Community# Food Bank: I just like helping people.

MADDOX THOMPSON, Volunteer, Community Food# Bank: Everyone's not always goin.. fortunate as others, so being able to come# out here for a few hours.. of just help other people out just brings# me a little glow in life, a little light.

LINDA PETERSEN-VARGAS, Volunteer, Community# Food Bank: We're all part of a community.## We should be helping each other out and# doing what we can to help our neighbors.

TOM HUGHES, Volunteer, Community# Food Bank: think it's just a## national trait that we do# this.

Yes, it's unself.. JUDY WOODRUFF: All told, last year, volunteers# here donated more than 100,000 hours of their## time.

That's equal to the work of# nearly 50 full-time paid employees.

TIMOTHY SHRIVER, Chairman of the Board,# Special Olympics: What great volunteer## organizations do is remind you that you can make# .. JUDY WOODRUFF: Brothers Tim and Mark Shriver# have both harnessed the power of volunteers in## their work at international organizations like# the Special Olympics and Save the Children.

MARK SHRIVER, Board of Directors, Special# Olympics: People want to get involved.

I mean,## human beings are social animals,# right?

We want to be together.

We## want to do something that's good for the# community, good for your neighborhood.

JUDY WOODRUFF: They say they learned about the# value and power of service from their parents,## Sargent and Eunice Kennedy Shriver.# Sargent Shriver founded the Peace Corps## and then pivoted to fight President# Lyndon Johnson's war on poverty,## creating programs like Head Start and VISTA... NARRATOR: America needs VISTA volunteers.

JUDY WOODRUFF: ... or Volunteers# in Service to America.

He wrote about it all in a new posthumously# published memoir, "We Called It a War."

TIMOTHY SHRIVER: Daddy was a trained lawyer,## and he was a political realist and he was# very tough-minded.

But he also paid a.. of attention to our mom.

And she believed# as much in the goodness of volunteers.

She -- while he was building Head Start,# she was building the Special Olympics## movement.

So our mom was always telling# him, those scholars you like, Sarge,## from Harvard and Yale, don't forget# the teenagers.

Don't forget the moms.

JUDY WOODRUFF: Did you hear these conversations?

TIMOTHY SHRIVER: I heard that conversation.# He.. He wanted an American commitment to# ending poverty.

He knocked on as many## doors of Republican members of Congress# and the Senate as he did of Democrats.

JUDY WOODRUFF: Back in Patagonia, as in many# other small and mid-sized communities across## the country, volunteer fire crews save# the local government money.

Nationwide,## the time donated by volunteer firefighters# adds up to almost $50 billion a year.

This is a big responsibility# you're taking on.

It's dangerous,## and yet people still want to# do it and not be paid for it.

ZAY HARTIGAN: I think there's a# certain pride in just stepping up## and filling a need and not putting# a price on it.

It's priceless.

JUDY WOODRUFF: Volunteers in this department# come to the job from all different backgrounds.

But for Dan Goff and Annette Walker, their# reasons for volunteering are the same.

ANNETTE WALKER, EMT, Patagonia# Volunteer Fire and Rescue: This town## has been very gracio.. JUDY WOODRUFF: How has this town been good to you?

ANNETTE WALKER: My kids, my husband# -- I said it -- a couple years ago,## totally lost everything.

And then this department# gave them something to do, and then I joined in## right after.

It was my way to give back to# our town, who stood by us the entire time.

DAN GOFF, EMT, Patagonia Volunteer Fire# and Rescue: I will be up front with you.## And I know there's a stigma to this.

I'm# actu.. and being of service is sort# of part of that recovery.

So## it helps me with my -- tackling my# addictions and helping the community.

JUDY WOODRUFF: Wow.

That's# really powerful to hear.

DAN GOFF: I got Narcan, an apartment,## and was able to help people who were# in a situation like I .. JUDY WOODRUFF: So you're able to pay back.

DAN GOFF: Absolutely, and it feels great.

JUDY WOODRUFF: And from one of Patagonia's# longest-serving firefighters, Richard Connolly: RICHARD CONNOLLY, Volunteer, Patagonia# Volunteer Fire and Rescue: I think that's## part of the United States is#.. And to keep that tradition going and make it# even stronger, the more we can do, the better.

JUDY WOODRUFF: For the "PBS News Hour,"# I'm Judy Woodruff in Patagonia, Arizona.

GEOFF BENNETT: Like countless# powerful women throughout history,## Queen Elizabeth II was routinely underestimated.# But during her record-breaking 70-year reign,## she deftly managed the important strategic# relationship between the U.K.

and the U.S.,## meeting with 13 sitting presidents, more# than any other American or foreign leader.

USA Today's Susan Page traces# this and more in her new book,## "The Queen and Her Presidents: The# Hidden Hand That Shaped History."

I spoke with her earlier today.

Susan Page, welcome back to the "News Hour."

SUSAN PAGE, Author: It's#so great to be here.

GEOFF BENNETT: In this book, you make# the point th.. formal power over policy.

But you argue that she## was genuinely consequential.

What did# her influence look like in practice?

SUSAN PAGE: Well, you think about, say, her# first trip to the United States as queen.## It was in the aftermath of the Suez crisis.# Relations between the United States and the## United Kingdom were as bad as they had been# since the start of the special relationship.

And, somehow, through her# charm and her personality,## her connection with President Eisenhower,# she healed that wound.

And in the aftermath,## suddenly, relations kind of resumed# again.

It's not that she negotiated## with the president.

It's that she laid# the groundwork for the kind of special## relationship that was so important to# Great Britain and so important to her.

GEOFF BENNETT: You mentioned President# Eisenhower.

You describe her bond with## him as something special.

She knew him# when he was the wartime general before## he was president.

How did that# early relationship differ from## the ones she had with presidents she# met only in their official capacities?

SUSAN PAGE: So, she revered Eisenhower.

And he## was like an uncle.

She was a friend of her# father's.

They had had a real partnership.

But by the time you get to, say, President# Reagan, she is a peer.

And she and President## Reagan became, I think, as close as she# was to any of the 13 American presidents## she met while they were in office.# They were -- they bonded over horses,## as you might expect, and over Hollywood,# because she was an enormous fan of the## movies and had seen Reagan acting in# movies before he went into politics.

GEOFF BENNETT: That special relationship,# she saw maintaining that, you write,## as really central to her role.

How# conscious and strategic was she about that.

SUSAN PAGE: So she was, as it turned out, a deft# diplomat.

She was a smart politician.

She was a## shrewd judge of character.

And I think these are# things people didn't recognize in her in her,## because it was so behind the scenes.

She didn't# write a memoir.

She didn't give interviews.

But she did deal with presidents in a way## that protected the interest of# her country over seven decades.

GEOFF BENNETT: I didn't know# this until reading your book,## but she had access to extraordinary# intelligence briefings.

How did .. SUSAN PAGE: So, almost every day, she# would get briefing papers.

Every week,## she would get top secret intelligence documents.

And so, over the period of decades, she# was as informed about intelligence issues## around the world as any other person# for over a longer period of time than## any leader and even over issues, say,# contingency plans for a nuclear war.

GEOFF BENNETT: Really?

SUSAN PAGE: She was th.. plans were over that whole narrative -- over that# whole time when nuclear war was such a threat.

GEOFF BENNETT: You write that there# were presidents who were smitten by her,## to include Truman, Reagan, George W. Bush.

But# soft power can only go so far in many respects.

So give us an example where she tried to use# her influence, but it simply didn't work.

SUSAN PAGE: Well, no one was more smitten# with her than President Trump.

He told me## when I interviewed him for the book that his# -- one of his earliest childhood memories was## being 6 years old sitting next to his mother# watching Elizabeth being crowned on television.

And when Queen Elizabeth met# with him during his first term,## there were high hopes that this would lead# to a trade deal that would be beneficial to## Great Britain.

That didn't happen.

There# were other factors, of course, in that.

There was finally a trade deal.

It# was after her -- after her death.

So## it didn't it didn't mean that she always# delivered.

But she was very disciplined## and she was always out there trying to# deliver.

Winston Churchill told her,## "Stay close to the Americans.

"# And that is what she tried to do.

GEOFF BENNETT: That Trump meeting, you report# that a senior British official described the queen## wearing the Obama brooch on the day of President# Trump's arrival as a silent act of resistance.

That is a striking claim for a monarch# who was really studied in neutrality.

SUSAN PAGE: A rare example of that.

But this was a brooch that Michelle Obama# had given her.

She had worn it only once,## and that was for the reciprocal dinner with# the Obamas.

For seven years, she had -- it## had not been seen in public.

Then, on the# day that President Trump arrives in England,## she is in a formal meeting with some# religious leaders and she's wearing it.

And I think those close to her told me# there was no other way to interpret that## but to interpret it as a statement of# resistance to Trump and a statement of## support for President Obama, with# whom she was actually quite close.

GEOFF BENNETT: The queen, as you# mentioned, gave no interviews,## never wrote a memoir.

She kept a diary.

How# did you go about reconstructing her inner life?

SUSAN PAGE: So, watch what she did, not what# she said, because what she said was, let's## toast our special relationship.

She was never# critical in public of any American president.

But there were presidents she clearly liked# and wanted to spend time with, and there were## presidents she did not.

She spent a lot of time# with Reagan and a fair amount of time with George## W. Bush.

She spent very little time with Jimmy# Carter.

And I think there was a message there.

GEOFF BENNETT: You have covered Washington# for decades.

What did you learn about the## presidency itself, not just the queen, by# looking at 13 presidents through her eyes?

SUSAN PAGE: We think about the# force of history of historic events,## and maybe it's easy to forget the# power of personality and the way## in which these relationships can# really matter, can have an effect.

Thinking about the Falklands War, there were# some in President Reagan's administration## who didn't want to come down on the side of# Great Britain.

And the relationship between## the queen and President Reagan and his very# strong interest in that horseback ride in## Windsor Park contributed to the decision# to come down hard on Great Britain's side.

GEOFF BENNETT: Susan Page.

The terrific# new book is "The Queen and Her Presidents:## The Hidden Hand That Shaped History."

Always great to speak with you.

SUSAN PAGE: Oh, it's so nice to see yo.. As always, there's a lot more online,# including a look at the hidden reasons## airlines are raising bag fees for some# passengers.

That's at PBS.org/NewsHour.

AMNA NAWAZ: And that is the "News# Hour" for tonight.

I'm Amna Nawaz.

GEOFF BENNETT: And I'm Geoff Bennett.

For all of us here at the "News.. thanks#for spending part of your evening with us.